KUNT PILLS

Interview by Steven Logan | Photos by Shea Petersen

Dayton, Ohio’s resident pop princess Kunt Pills started performing on DIY Zoom concerts during the pandemic, discovering a passion for pure pop music that was formerly bubbling under the surface. In the wake of her new self-titled album, she’s ready to burst into real-life scenes and stages.

Tell me about making your new album.
Oh girl. Okay, so KP5 - I still call it KP5, but it’s Kunt Pills: Self-Titled. It was two years of shitty jobs and money problems, and being nineteen and twenty. That’s all the project has been, it was a lot of that, but fun to make. I just really did deep dives into pop music, all types of pop music from all eras and I kind of let the frustrations of having to grow up post-COVID while transitioning go through the music. I let pop music help me make sense of all that.

So why self-titled at this moment?
So before this, I guess the music I was making didn't feel like it matched my name. And my name didn't match the music that I wanted to make, if that makes sense. Because I didn't have the same level of production experience. For Kunt Pills: Self-Titled, it was like, I'm becoming that artist.

I'm becoming that pop figure that I've had in my mind since I first started producing, you know? And it was like I really solidified the character that is Kunt Pills - it's not really like a character, but I just solidified the ethos of it. You know, the world of like, “What am I trying to do with KP and being cunt?” And that's what it was. I just wanna be cunt.

And so what is the ethos and like world of Kunt Pills? And what is that character?
Kunt Pills is very confident and fiery. To me, she's very much like the hostess of a party. It's kind of like someone telling you where the afters are. That's who she feels like.

She's the girl that knows where the afters are.
She's the girl in the bathroom, drunk as fuck, telling you that you're gonna be something. You know, she's the girl in the bathroom with you, and you're like, “I don't know that girl. I don't know what she's on, but she definitely just boosted my head up.” And we love her. But she's also like a little bit of a crybaby, so she's also the girl drunk in the bathroom crying at the club, you know? 

So Kunt Pills is kind of like the most emotionally expressive and charismatic person you know. And you kinda can’t get enough of her. That's why I make the music so, like, tasty and poppy, because it's like, you just want more. You want more of that girl, but you also know you can't take too much of it. That's Kunt Pills.

You can't overdose on Kunt Pills.
You cannot, yeah. That's the core of it. The problem is not overdosing on Kunt Pills.

Have you always produced your own music?
Yeah. I started making stuff in 2018 or so, and I was just making little stuff on SoundCloud. My username on SoundCloud was like “Bjork’s extra pinky”, which I thought was funny, and I just posted these really weird, chopped up, old techno mixes. I didn't know how to sample at the time. It was mostly plagiarizing. Then I got into a lot of YouTube tutorials, and then I tried to go to school for audio engineering, and that was just boring. But I did take what I learned from there, and I kind of adapted it to my music.

But yeah, I’ve learned I can't describe the beats I want to people. I find you can't always describe certain stuff to producers who don't - I don’t want to say they don’t have the ear, but who don’t have that thing about pop music, or don’t know the random, sometimes dated sounds that make pop pop, you know? Down to like when to add a cowbell here, and when to add like an orchestra hit there. When I'm telling someone, “I want the Y2K beat, but I want the dubstep elements, but I also want a weird orchestral vibe that has like a Kate Bush undertone.” And they’re like “What? What does that mean?” And so that's when you just have to make it yourself.

Sonically, what was the inspiration behind the album? I know you mentioned you were looking through a bunch of different eras of pop so what was your scope? What were your touch points?
My first idea for the whole album - I wanted to make “New Jack dark pop”. So like New Jack Swing mixed with dark pop. It kind of transformed over time, but I started off listening to a lot of Jimmy Jam and Terry Lewis, Prince, Michael, stuff from that time. And then also really breaking down the tracks from like 2010 and 2011, like a lot of Max Martin tracks for sure, just really trying to figure out the little things that they do. 

You know, it took a lot of watching interviews and listening to people describe Prince's process in the booth, and listening to people describe how Michael recorded vocals. And it's not necessarily in there directly, but taking those things and being like, “Okay, so that's what gives it that feeling.” Now, how can I take that and adapt it to the current sonic world that I’m building?

There are songs on the album where you can hear me first figuring out that sound. “EXE” was one of the earliest I made, and you can hear clearly the beginning of my process, and by the end of it, “Artist” was when I was able to just make a cohesive pop song that has the elements from the 80s, 90s, 2000s, but it all just fits well and still feels modern in 2024.

So if you were giving somebody a tip on producing, what's the one thing you can add to a song like that will make it pop? What is one element that people don't think about?
Okay, so layer your drums, layer drum loops. It sounds crazy. Whether you program drums by hand or if you just kind of throw it on the grid, no matter what, just layer a drum loop under it and turn it down. That's something I directly picked up from Jimmy Jam and Terry Lewis. And when that's happening, like sonically, especially if they're panned and stuff like that, it makes the song sound very energetic, but also it feels like the beat is ever evolving. You know, it can be like the same three loops going on through the entire song and everything else around it is changing, but because it's like sonically hitting you in such different places, it just works. And it fills out a song nicely. 

And also, fucking autotune. Like, bro, I love that shit. I don't care.

What's your favorite song that you've made of your own?
“Artist”. Yeah, “Artist” or “Stumbling”. That's when I knew, after I made those two songs I was like “I kind of ate that.” It’s funny, one of my roommates at the time was falling asleep on the phone with their partner and their partner heard me recording in the background the night I made “Artist”. The next day they told me they heard me singing the chorus and at one point I said to myself “Oh bitch, I ate that.” And I did!

You said you started making music in 2018, but when did it become Kunt Pills? When did it change from a hobby to a defined project, what was that moment? 
I want to say that 2020, I think it became serious right before we went under quarantine. I had started sending songs to little internet labels for compilations and stuff to try to get my name out there. And my stuff was still not as good, so I wasn’t getting picked, and I was getting left on read by other producers because at that time, I was a lot more open to wanting to do collaborations. 

Crazy how when you're bad at making music, you want to do collaborations with everybody, and no one has the heart to be like “Yeah, I don’t like this”. 

But then after that, I connected with the right people online. People like Chloe Hotline, Ivy Hollivana, Docx, for a second, Backxwash. You know, a lot of talent, just talented people through Twitter.

And then the Zoom shows started happening, and the Zoom shows, like, unlocked something in me. Kunt Pills didn't seem like it could make money until the Zoom shows started. I was like, “Oh, wait! People are into it. This is fun.” And I leaned I was kind of good at doing a little show. Because honestly, before KP, I was going to be a drag queen for a long time. But I was like, “I actually hate people handing money to me like that.” So, you know, Kunt Pills just started to make a lot more sense. That was my way of going HAM and getting all that energy out. 

And when did you choose the name Kunt Pills? What was that moment?
I chose the name Kunt Pills sometime in quarantine. I was honestly just changing my username on Instagram, for real, but I was also thinking, “Well, you change your username nowadays, and that's your brand.” So it was between Kunt Pills or TransBabyKate…

For Kate Bush?
Yeah. But I was also like, “I can't bite off Young Baby Tate like that.” So Kunt Pills just kind of made the most sense. And Kunt Pills comes from like, I was taking a lot of ADHD meds at the time, I was very doped up. And I would often joke with my friends like, “No, no, no, I have to take these, like the pills make me cunt!” And it was like pre-estrogen, and you know, it stuck. I was like, I have to take the cunt pill. 

You know, and it's provocative. Immediately, and I hear this from everyone, all the time, they're like, I saw Kunt Pills on a flyer, and I was like, “I have to see what she's giving, like, what, that sounds like an interesting name.” That was the point!

How do you feel like your sound or your style has evolved from when you started to now?
So before, I was trying to be Bjork, I was trying to be like trip hoppy and like super reverbed, I was trying to get the most making the least or like - I'm not gonna say putting the least effort into my music, but like I was kind of cutting corners, I feel like, production wise. But also sonically I was in that place. I was in a very much in a place where I was cutting corners when it came to my mental health, so it was coming out in the music. I was also super into, like, techno. I really thought I was like a huge club girl before I could even get into clubs and raves and stuff, I thought I really had to be the techno girl. 

And it was like, “Okay, you like techno, but you really like pop.” And I didn't really click into that right away. You know, I lived through the Tumblr apocalypse, you know, Lana, Marina, Charli, when everyone was darkwave and everyone was witch house and alt and seapunk. I was definitely seapunk for a while. So that world kind of puts you in a place where, like, you feel like you can't listen to generic pop music. You can't listen to stuff that's not alternative. And I didn’t for a long time. 

And then, I don't know, I think after life got so serious, life got so crazy that I was like, “I have to listen to a pop song to live.” Especially during COVID. And then it just changed something in me. I got deeper into Janet Jackson and Britney Spears. And then I also realized that Kate Bush is a lot more pop than people think, it's just very forward thinking and so a lot of my production techniques are like weird modernized versions of the shit that she was doing. 

So I guess it changed a lot in the sense that like, I'm a lot less - I was gonna say I'm a lot less pretentious, but I'm probably just as pretentious about music. Just in a different genre.

So you started performing your music during COVID on these Zoom shows, which is how I found you. But what has it been like having to take that and like transition into real life shows and like translate that into like in-person performing? 
Honestly, it’s been way better. I'm an overachiever. So the Zoom shows were something serious for me because I had just moved out of my mom's. I felt like I had a lot to prove, even though it was only a bunch of strangers in the Zoom shows. I took it really really seriously, so it was kind of jarring when I would go into the Zoom shows, and I never felt like I was the only one taking it seriously, but I felt like everyone else had a lot more fun. Like they were fine just being on their webcam dancing. Whereas I felt like I had to perform. I had to treat it like the VMAs, as I always say. 

But performing live, like you really get that tangible feeling, you know. I feel like people can just type whatever, like seeing like a chat blow up on Zoom does feel great. But then when you're in front of those people, and they know songs or like they're dancing, that is like a completely different vibe. And also it's just easier. I wouldn't wish audio routing or trying to figure out like intricate like screen recording or like zoom setups. I wouldn't wish setting that shit up on no one, honestly.

Okay, so speaking of the live performance element, you incorporated the headset microphone yesterday at Citypill. Is that new?
I've done it twice now. I played a show in Dayton at this venue called Meow House. And I pulled it out for the first time and people were receptive to it. I could tell that they were a little gagged by it. But it was a need. Yeah, it was like literally a necessity. I felt like I was being chained by handheld mics. First of all, I only do a two-step when I have a handheld mic. It's harder for me to really dance and get free because I suck at learning choreo, but I love dancing. And then I felt vocally more confident. I feel like a handheld mic is giving the audience the false impression that I'm more of a vocalist than I am, in all honesty. At least with the fucking headset they're like, “Well, yeah, she's dancing.” I don't feel as much of a need to over vocalize to the audience to make up for the fact that I’m using autotune.

You get in that Brittany, Janet mindset.
And with the hair too?

Yeah, tell me about the hairography and the background of it.
Oh, honey, I love hair.

The hairography was going off last night. 
Really? I worked so hard on it. This is like a whole thing. I hate wearing wigs, but I love hair. So I was trying to figure out, you know, the best way to get my fantasy, you know. I mostly do my own hair because I'm too broke to get it done, honestly. And it works, you know. It's a whole lot of staring at pictures of like, you know, or like reading old magazines about like, who did Janet Jackson’s sew-ins? What type of extensions was she using? K-tips or I-tips? Like, I really go there. It's not even just Janet Jackson or Britney. I'm like, I just like hair, you know? I'm honestly thinking of going to cosmetology school. So like hair is important. I feel like it just adds to the whole image.

And tell me about what you learned about how you have to cut your hair and do the hairography. 
So Britney rocks a nice shag, for the fucking extensions, so they blend in right? And I started like using clip-ins, I use my kinky ones, and then I added body wave hair on to it so it was even longer. So when I sweat, since my hair is gonna revert back to being curly, having extra long hair on it that's straight will help achieve the wet hair look.I love a wet hair look, like sweating and getting your life on stage. That's what Janet Jackson does best. Her extensions were built for that. They don't revert, they just look really good. It's like, “Oh, she's working up there.” You know, I've even learned about Michael's extensions. Like, I don't play. You know, I understand the process of a silk press sweating out on stage, that's something that Prince knows how to work. 

I don't know, I think hairography is just…as Britney said in her book. you know, “It shows the boys you’re having fun.” And it just feels good, like feeling the hair slap your face. You know, sometimes you just gotta white girl dance and get your life. And it's all about hair. Hair hair hair hair hair.

You understand that hair is an important part of pop.
It really is. And I think it's just because it's glamour, it's fantasy. You know, it shows people where you are. For my project before this, Becoming, I was wearing my lavender hair, I had this lavender dress down and I ate it up because I felt like I was blossoming. I felt like a flower, you know, I was becoming. So then going into KP5, it was the braided bob. I was also super inspired by Brandy at the time, you know, a lot of Brandy was getting played because I love Darkchild's production. So I was very much taking my inspiration from her. I was like, I need to wear a bob.

What else inspires you visually, when it comes to presenting yourself visually with your music, like what do you get inspired by? Outside of hair, of course.
I love visual art. And comic books. I love comic books. And like superhero shit. Oddly enough, anything otherworldly. Give me some like multiversal shit. I eat it up. It doesn't come out in the music as much, but it is like in performing. You know, that kind of like, be like a superhero.

Larger than life.
Yeah, it's all about the power of a character, a persona. I went to school for visual arts in high school, and I just like painting and drawing and stuff like that. I follow a lot of artists that have OCs, you know, original characters - and the stories that they create for them. I think it's always been like one of those things where it’s easy to build worlds off of that sonically.

I think back to when people used to make visuals for Vocaloid songs and stuff like that. Like sometimes you could see art that makes you make a song based off of it. You know what I mean? Like for certain stuff you can hear an image. That happens a lot for me.

What is the scene like in Dayton, what is that like?
The scene in Dayton is actually pretty interesting. It's growing. It’s very band-centric and it very much prioritizes instrumentation and musicality. Especially artists like Malina Marie, Eleanor Dakota, Das Grandiose, Proxy World, EXE. Those are artists that are just really turning it up in there right now. It's not necessarily hard to break into, but it's one of those things where I have an arm's length relationship with it.
But the little stuff that's happening underground with the queer people around it, that’s what I'm really trying to cultivate and push and help build. 

You said it's heavy on instrumentation and stuff like that - so does your stuff get an odd reception or do you people know what to make of it? 
They're not like, weird towards me necessarily. But it is just one of those things where it's harder for people to like click into. It's so weird how you can be in a city full of people. And it does feel like a lot less people in the city listen to pop music. It's like, what the fuck? Like, this is a joke. 

But also I have to take into account in Dayton, a lot of times it's not even about the music. You know, it's more of a political thing that kind of makes me and Dayton musically not necessarily always like mesh because sometimes politically it's just like, you know Not the venue sometimes politically. t's just like not the crowds because politically it's just like not the vibe.

Last question - what’s next for Kunt Pills?
What’s next for Kunt Pills? Kunt Pills wants to tour. Yes, mama wants to tour badly. But outside of that, I definitely want a really good music video. I really want to shoot something for KP5 before I run into a new era. Something like - well, I'm not gonna say specifically what I want to shoot a video for or a visual for. 

Yeah. No spoilers.
Right. But fingers crossed that, you know, I get all my corners crossed, but I would love a nice visual. And just to get to do a lot more shows with the headset mic. Soon dancers. two dancers are something that I'm really like, following around in my mind, you know, just something nice to like, fill out that stage.

So you're gonna get more into the choreography?
Oh yeah, because I feel like I can’t teach myself choreography. And I get anxious around people who can learn choreography. I get so stressed out in my head, and I feel like with two dancers I could start to feel comfortable and break down that wall. That's something I really want to do, and then that leads me into better dancing classes. And you know, even singing classes. Like I really just want to hone in on the craft that is like the performing.

And then more collabs, but not too many. It’s not that I hate them, but…

You want to keep it your own thing.
Yeah, I'm a diva. Not really. I'm like a fake diva, where I'm a diva after I walk out the room. So in the room I’m like “No, I love this song.” And then I leave and I’m like “Ugh, why did I say that I liked that?” So I’m trying not to even put myself in those situations and trying to be very selective about collaborations. 

So it's like, you know, I'm looking for in person collaborations, that's what it is. Online collaborations are not it, I'm over it. Don't send me no WAV. Invite me to the studio.